Reading the article, it has more options than my ContourHD...
can it be a new model??
see ; http://www.engadget.com/2009/0...
"snip...Again, 1080p is the big news here, with the camera recording 30fps at a full 1920 x 1080 resolution. It can also capture 30fps at 1280 x 960, either 30 or 60 fps at 1280 x 720 (720p), and 60fps at 848 x 480. There are quite a few other things to tweak beyond resolution and frame rates, though. In our review of the 720p ContourHD we noted that the microphone noise was extreme when exposed to even moderate wind, and now its sensitivity can be modified to suit your speed. So too can the contrast, metering (center, average, or spot), and exposure. The cam's final software package wasn't available for our testing, but the plan is to allow tweaking of individual parameters as well as to offer pre-defined profiles, like snowboarding, car racing, or sky diving -- which we would hazard to guess entails the lowest microphone setting. "
Why do I feel like a BETA tester?
And me on my 4th cam due to QC.
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I must admit that I feel much the same. The new version seems to have certain features that deal with key issues of the old one as a tacit acknowledgement that there have been problems.
However, it is always possible we may still get some of these new features if the firmware can be upgraded so I'm staying hopeful.
On my third cam, btw.
John
Well I hope so ...
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Sounds like they bumped up the Resolution options, not "fixed the problems" I havne't had any problems with either my VholdR or my ContourHD.
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None of my contourhds (which had focus issues) coped well with anything other than either a very brightly lit foreground on a sunny day or shaded/all ground shots where there was no sky to affect the overall exposure. There have been several posts here from users who find that even a dull sky in the top third of the picture significantly darkens the areas they actually want to see. In addition, vholdr have acknowledged they chose saturation settings at the expense of some overall picture brightness.
The adjustments possible in the new model look like going a long way to address these issues.
and still no 25p. this is not a crack at Vholdr, as they make a good piece of kit, but why must PAL users always suffer whilst waiting for 25fps to be supported?
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I imagine because most devices are meant for web or computer playback, not for broadcasting or DVD burning.. and honestly, if you're making DVDs or doing broadcasting, you've got the tools for doing a conversion.
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no matter how good your conversion is, it will never look as good as if it was shot in the right frame rate to begin with. Software conversion is a very long process to do right. last time I tested it was around 60 times realtime. (That was doing some tests for using the Canon 5D on the new BSG series). ie. 1 hour to process 1 minute of footage. Try that with 10 hours of footage, and you will be waiting a long time.
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I agree with Alister, I'm in PAL land and I'm forced put the files through Compressor to convert for use in Final Cut Pro, otherwise I have to render all the time in a mixed format timeline. I tend to convert them over night to the 25 or 50i codec. It's a bit of a bind, but the camera is still quality.
I thought I was being a bit churlish asking for 25P or 50i but the new camera at 1080P would seem a fairly straight forward software change to provide 25P 50i as opposed to 30 60, I'm not tech but surely it's a speed of refresh on sensor.
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Any idea when it's released to the public, most places just say pre-order.
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Late Oct is what I saw in a few places..
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I saw late Oct+
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....bah this sucks. I just bought a ContourHD in hope that it would be great for motorsports and now they come with this just a month after. Setting microphone gain and contrast should be on the HD as well....
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ah man this is bad news! just bought a contourHD!!!
just 2 weeks...
and there wasn't any sign of the new version anywhere, no advertising or nothing else.
this is not a good strategy for us but this is so damn good for the manufacturer I think!!!
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I feel like Arnold in Total Recall.
Security: "How long have you had your ContourHD?"
Me: "Two weeks."
Then I start pulling at my mouth & have to remove my head... which explodes soon after.
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2002 XR250R
Is there going to be a firmware update, as I only got mine yesterday :S
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SSILB Main Website = www.sandownlifeboat.com
SSILB Facebook Fan Page = www.facebook.com/profile.php?i...
Ouch, I waited for mine to be available in stores locally but it was so "NEW" I had to order online if I wanted it for my bday (sept 28th). Nobody said anything about a newer one ANYWHERE. Now, 2 days later I get the skinny that a better camera with all the features this one is lacking is available! Not cool! Yeah technology rolls forward all the time and what you buy today is obsolete tomorrow. However, this definately leaves a foul odor in the air. Lets hope for a firmware update.
On a side note; I find it funny that one of the primary complaints is the camera functions poorly in dull light yet the camera was developed in Seattle? Cloudy, Rainy Seattle....seems odd, but this is my primary compalint as well. I guess all the R&D occured during the summer month(s)?
All I want for Christmas is a firmware update.
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KofSeattle
Received my Contour HD 2 days ago ... just have to roll with the punches I guess
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still no explaination from the officials ???
pfff...
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See below.
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Nate
VholdR Support
support@vholdr.com
what do you want explanation on?
the only question i see in the first post of this thread is: can it be a new model??
yes, didnt you get the mail?
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you only read the first and the last posts ??
yeah, I got the mail and realised the new model has released.
Following that I wrote here in this topic to say that why I am upset.
And just like me, many people are upset, and there are questions about a new firmware release.
If you please to read, this is the situation...
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Add me to the list for wanting a firmware update. I doubt we'll get higher resolutions but the ability to tweak contrast and such would be very welcome.
Firmware update would be great since I just received two cameras just this week. Oct 1.
Having some trouble uploading though. Sound improvements would be great Tommac has done some
great things and shown some great pics and instructions for optional mic.
Where did everyone hear about the new cameras?
720p at 60fps would work for me as an upgrade, if it's not hardware limitation.
Otherwise bit dissapointed :)
i would be very suprised if its just a software upgrade thats needed for the 1080 version.
think of it, why would they say they are going to release a new model, if its just software?
why would they have the page called 'which to buy' if its just one model?
how are they supposed to keep people from buying the 720 version and self-upgrade it to 1080 if its only software?
why are you all beeing so negative about them launching a new product? all companies launch new products.
i can undestand that some of you that just bought the 720 version is 'unhappy' about the bad timing, but thats the way life goes so stop crying like little babies now!
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im with you on this one, the other thing you all need to remember is at least we are given a place to voice our oppinions about the product. the competition (if you could call them that) havent got the balls to have their product criticised in the public on their own site, at least vholdr do listen to the critisism of their product and do something about it, just remember 'you cant please all the people all the time,just some of the people some of the time'
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That's a bit hard on those here (not me, btw - I bought mine in June) who have only just spent their money on a model that's significantly inferior to its replacement.
This goes on all the time, of course. Sometimes new model changes are little more than cosmetic and late buyers don't get a raw deal. However, there are ways that a company can minimise the negative effects on late buyers of launching a much improved model at the same price point. They all work by providing ways of discounting prices towards the end of line stage so that late purchasers pay a price that reflects the lower feature count.
There are at least four different ways in which this can be done, most of of them involving price adjustments in the lead-in phase or through adding value to the old product by throwing in free or discounted accessories, but it can be difficult for a small company to manage. If they undersell their later production of the older model, they can be left with a lot of stock to clear. Discounting it could lose them a lot of money spent in its manufacture.
All these things are a balance. A large company might be so market-dominant that annoying some of its existing customer base through short lead-in times for new models has no impact. A small company that gets its market share from a reputation for supporting its customer base might be prepared to take a hit if it can but circumstances can dictate otherwise.
John
the problem is that if they would have announced this six months ago, those who bought their camera 'the day before six months' would been pissed and nobody would buy a camera for six months.
the other extreme option is to not announce it at all, just let it hit the market the day it was finnished, that would keep 'maximum sales' untill releasedate but would make people pissed for not giving them the heads up.
so doing something in between might be a good solution?
announcing a month before the release will significantly drop sales during that month but will most likely give a big boost the next.
still people get pissed, maybe thats beeing human?
they did send a mail a few days ago saying:
"In November we’re finally going to be able to provide an upgrade program for any VholdR customers who want to buy a ContourHD (stay tuned for an email with the details)."
i dont know what that means in real life but i belive that is something in the line of what you are saying about minimize the damage.
and as i see it, they had to announce it now. GoPro will soon ship their HD camera, and if vholdr dont announce in time to create the 'hype' they are done.
my opionion about vholdrs way of dealing with this is, they did everything well.
unless there is a big delay in production, everything is done the way i would expect them to deal with a new product beeing released.
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I don't think anyone would see six months as a realisitic lead-in time. I bought mine four months ago and I'm not upset that a new one has come out, only that some issues with the current model remain (and that my bike mount purchased then has yet to appear!)
In fact, it gives grounds for hope that my model might get some firmware updates for exposure tweaks. I'm not sure that a customer survey of 1 has any great validiity :) I agree, though, that you're never going to make everyone happy. There will always be people at the cut-off point who will lose out.
I don't know what the best lead-in time would be but based on what other companies do, a month or two for a major change seems ok provided it's linked with some kind of customer incentive. If it's just a case of minor tweaks to the older model then there's no real issue.
I think the best way to cheer up old users is to give new improved software.
As I watch my videos I'm sure that 1080p is not only software, but 720p 60fps?
I'd like to see some official statement on this.
It is not just "hey we are developing a new model and do not buy our old model!" kind of thing
there are lots of advertisement and previews about many products before the new ones comes out.
but, when the new model's release date is announced, the old one normally should be sold for less prices.
look at PS3, everyone knew that the slim model will come months before it is released, and yet prices dropped and purchase continued peacefully.
Good customer care is something that every company can not achieve.
Selling the old model today, and tomorrow saying "here you are, the new model is released and we are not sorry if you have the old one!"
this is way beyond customer care, and much close to filling their pockets I think.
Of course it is great to hear new models, upgrades but the way they inform us is not great as you see...
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I thought they dropped the price on the "old" ContourHD?
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ooohhhhh stirred up a bloody great hornets nest this one ;-) , im sure we will hear from nate or one of the others soon on this one. dont start me on the old ps3 route, hard drives failing, latest ones not backwards compatable with ps1 games etc.etc....
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First off, thanks for all the posts, we always love the forum chatter and it's cool to see a flurry of activity surrounding our release. Here's some bullet points I'll post in both major threads surrounding this conversation.
1. Upgrade: The launch message was referring to a VholdR to ContourHD upgrade. We really do like upgrades and I know we'd like to do an HD to 1080 upgrade as well, but that's not something I can promise at the moment. I can tell you that if we do offer an upgrade, it probably won't happen in the first couple of months. So in the meantime love and use your ContourHD, or throw down the bucks and have two awesome cameras!
2. Firmware: We're a small company, but we're trying to push the envelope as much as possible. We had an opportunity to add the latest in video components and add a new model to our line based on many of the thinks you have asked for. We also certainly hear you about wanting options with ContourHD. While I can tell you that the resolution or frame rate will not be upgradable in firmware (because it's hardware) I can tell you that we really want to support a wider variety of lighting conditions with the original ContourHD. We've been working on that for a while and we don't have a solution we want to put out there yet, we certainly aren't giving up. I hope to post more information on that in the future.
3. Timing: There's never really an easy way to do this. We thought giving you a month's heads up was a pretty good balance and it allowed us to set a release date we were confident we could hit. I can tell you another fact, this will not be the last model we ever make, so eventually even this unit will be outdated. Such is life in electronics :-)
Guys, I hope this sheds some light in the windows of VholdR. We're big fans of our customers, you guys make awesome vidz and we want all of you to love us. We'll keep doing our best to make that happen.
Thanks!
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Nate
VholdR Support
support@vholdr.com
Something you guys should consider too is that this new camera is pretty ahead of it's time. I'm not trying to blow smoke, that's the truth. Most people don't even have the hardware to Play 1080p video. Most people's computers can't hand it, that's assuming their monitor's resolution is even that high. And the average HD TV is only 1080i.
My point is, don't cry because you "only" have a ContourHD right now. As much as I'd like to get my hands on the new one. Few, if any of my audience would be able to enjoy my videos. Even now I have to downsize most of my videos for friends and family.
This camera is for enthusiasts and ESPN. Maybe in a year or two when everyone's rockin fiber connections and beastly computers I'll get one but I'm honestly quite happy with my original ContourHD.
yes you are right Bean, but I don't care about 1080p videos.
what I really want is 720p @60fps which is super smooth, that would be great I think.
Also being able to customise the brightness and microphone boost is also great.
my PC's monitor is 22" and resolution is 1680*1050 very close to 1080p but no need to have it, 720p is ok.
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Thats a good point! Kinda the best of both worlds.
Shit, now I've gotta get one heh
Bean is very right. From our tests many computers can't really handle the increased definition. In fact, 720 @ 60fps is the hardest for video cards to render, so be careful what you wish for, unless you want to run out and buy a Mac Pro tower for 3k ;-)
That being said, 1080 and 960 are super cool and the new sensor is really good with variable lighting conditions.
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Nate
VholdR Support
support@vholdr.com
I don't think that would be a big problem.
nvidia8800gt is ok I think.
also, rendering after editing a video eats up a lot of ram and cpu power. no need for so great video cards for our amateur purposes.
also the field of view in 720p is very good, SD mode in contour HD is like clipped off from HD mode.
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:) It's good to hear that someone shares my wishes :)
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So is a 720p @60fps firmware possible on the current model Nate?
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SSILB Main Website = www.sandownlifeboat.com
SSILB Facebook Fan Page = www.facebook.com/profile.php?i...
Bean is righ SSILB, the hardware in the ContourHD is maxed at 720@30.
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Nate
VholdR Support
support@vholdr.com
I highly doubt increasing the speed/resolution on the old ContourHD is possible.
It would most likely need faster chips to handle it. I think at most, we'll see the addition of contract/brightness/etc type settings.
Just looking at the ContourHD features page...
http://vholdr.com/contourhd/fe...
and noticed the specs...1920x1280...is this correct...or shouldn't it be 1920x1080...
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[quote]
Full HD - 1080p (1920x1280)
Tall HD - 960p (1280x960)
Action HD - 720p (1280x720)
Contour HD - 720p (1280x720)
Fast SD - WVGA (848x480)
[/quote]
------------------------------
Emma
Nice catch, we'll get that fixed!
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Drew
If I play the videos from my CHD in VLC player I can actually get much more dynamic range from the picture than it otherwise shows. When I decrease the contrast I can suddenly see much more detail in the shadows and even some in the skys. I´m on a calibrated monitor so it´s 100% the video.
Contrast change would be great for the CHD.
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I'm wondering if there is still the softness around the edges in the new model or if that has been fixed?
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There still is a little softness at the far sides but overall the clarity is improved.
Good question....
The reason we have it now is the SD mode is really the same as HD mode but cropped!
In HD mode the cam saves all the data and on this lens you get a little fisheye effect.
Old HD lens = same as New 1080p cam lens ;
Old = 135° 720p ... 110° WVGA
New = 135° - 960p and 720p...110° - 1080p and WVGA
Since the lens is the same I would guess Yes!
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Any updates on this?